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laackejim
Committed Member



USA
3274 Posts

Posted - Dec 11 2005 :  04:22:07  Show Profile
Vittorio,

You are ON. Thank you.

As to my impatience. I tried to make sure I recognized your response in my note. As for the rest. Well, it may seem strange for an old man to be that impatient but I guess I was. I stand humbled and properly chastised. I guess I felt like I had just finished struggling through the conceptual woods and found my way to the very gates of the Academy, snuck in and found that the big boys didn't pay any attention to my claims that I had solved the riddle of the universe. Hmmmm. thinking of it that way, maybe I should be embarrased rather than chastised.

Jim


quote:
Originally posted by vrossi

Jim, please add my name to the list of judges.

As for the lack of responses (well, "lack" is not quite correct, since I promptly answered you), you must consider that this Forum was born exactly one week ago, and now has only 22 registered members (plus some lurkers, since it is open in read-only mode to everybody). Therefore, the potential market for any proposal is currently very small.

I believe that in the next weeks more and more people will register and the discussions will heat up. We only need to let more people know about the existence of this place. By the way, may I ask anybody here to put a link to this Forum in any other place where it can be of interest (other related forums, sites, etc.) ?

Bye





Uncle Jim (e=mc2)
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laackejim
Committed Member



USA
3274 Posts

Posted - Dec 11 2005 :  04:35:35  Show Profile
Thank you Joe, you are on the panel. I will let you know how things are going.

As to the topic of business applications, education is clearly one and especially areas of education not popular topics yet. I think the biggest, no make that most valuable, area is in education of the kids who can't make it in the system. Special education costs twice per student what regular education does (I am a trustee of the local school district, ahem, that means board member, not inmate) and my wife is a special ed teacher in another district. Costs are twice at a minimum per student. And, unless you have one of the rare and talented teachers, the programs are minimally successful. Most of these kids are very bright although unable to cope with society and themselves. The laundry list is of reasons is long However, one thing does appear (to me) to stand out. They are more likely to attach to and believe a computer friend than another human from "regular society". I hope to test the idea that they will tend to connect and attach to the VHuman even if THEY themselves create it by writing the brain themselves. Especially if the VHuman learns and changes once it is built.

another area of, I think, significant value is creating a "normal human brain" relative to responses to a standard set of life situations (answers, questions etc input by the user). IF these sets were carefully crafted they would walk a good line around normal. Then create a series of other brains, each with a specific kind of disorder or drug effect or alcohol influence etc. Using the same input situations and experiencing the different responses would match what a lot of these kids live with every day. Then, tie the explanation to specific areas of the brain and changes that are made by the alcohol etc. I really think this is doable and would be valuable.

Jim
and thanks again Joe.


quote:
Originally posted by Joe Repka

Jim, put me on your list of judges.

Tying this in to the topic, education is one industry where commercial potential is significant. Language learning is one more specific area where NL chat bots can be useful to both teachers and learners by providing an interesting means of individualized exposure to language forms, a more realistic practice environment and a testing mechanism.

Presentation of background nad the most basic level of almost any subject area can be facilitated by an AI chat bot that can control a multimedia presentation. Another idea is research guidance and resource discovery for any subject. The idea is to add true and adaptive interaction based on NL to the kinds of things presented by video tape or interactive multimedia programs.



Uncle Jim (e=mc2)
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hologenicman
Moderator



USA
3323 Posts

Posted - Dec 11 2005 :  08:50:06  Show Profile  Visit hologenicman's Homepage
Hey there,

quote:
Well, it may seem strange for an old man to be that impatient but I guess I was.


"Older" sounds much better than old, wouldn't you say.

And I translate impatient as EXCITED!

Honest and sincere interest in helping youth is beneficial to all. It's beneficial to them, it's beneficial to society, and it's beneficial to business. Business interest doesn't have to be high profit, just profit.

I'd like to point out the example of LifeFX versus Haptek/Zabaware:

http://www.lifefx.com/introA.html

http://www.haptek.com/?url=http://www.haptek.com/products/peopleputty/tour/

http://www.zabaware.com/home.html

LifeFX wants $1,995.00 for their package. I believe that once I saw a quote for $5,000 or so from them to create a custom character from photos for you. (Poser and Yapanda's software can do this)

On the other hand, The Haptek player is free, their people putty and character package is a total of $70.00.

Zabaware gets even better with a UltraHal and Extra characters for a total of $50.(plus $25 for Natural sounding Neospeech that I can't wait to arrive through the mail).

Zabaware has developed an extensive online user base that is excited about using and expanding the product. I wasn't mistaken, I said "expanding". Zabaware, instead of charging high fees and keeping the product a proprietary secret, has set their prices low and made the brain editor available to encourage users to modify the code according to their own needs and ambitions. Instead of using the complex (but powerful) C++ language that would have put it out of the hands of many, they chose BASIC as the scripting language of choice.

No, this is not an advertisement for Zabaware, but it is a sugestion to follow their example as a sucessful business model. If we make the product/service that we develope both affordable and accessable, there is a greater chance for success. I would suggest zabbaware (OK, this IS an advertisement for Zabaware) Since they allow for a "plugin" program to be built fairly easily that uses the affordable UltraHal product intact. We could make money from selling the Plugin especially if the plugin serves a specific education need or commercial need as we identify them. Lets not try to mystify it, but rather, let's try to invite our customers into participating in the product or service by demystifying it...

John L>

HologenicMan
John A. Latimer
http://www.UniversalHologenics.com

"If the Human brain were so simple that we could understand it,
we would be so simple that we couldn't..."
-Emerson M Pugh-

Current project:http://www.vrconsulting.it/vhf/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=816&whichpage=1

DISCOVERY: The more I learn, the more I learn how little I know.
GOAL: There's strength in simplicity.
NOTE: Goal not always achieved.
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maviarab
Curious Member



United Kingdom
27 Posts

Posted - Dec 11 2005 :  15:49:51  Show Profile  Visit maviarab's Homepage
Holo,

as you mentioned poser, just a quick note to let you know (and others) that we at DG are looking into fuklly interfacing poser characters into a full working 3d application for ultrahal

Ask not what your bot can do for you, ask what you can do for your bot

www.aidreams.co.uk
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hologenicman
Moderator



USA
3323 Posts

Posted - Dec 11 2005 :  17:55:22  Show Profile  Visit hologenicman's Homepage
Hey there,

That would be way kool. I have sooooo much money invested in poser characters and accessories.

The only problem that I can forsee is that the poser license (Victoria, Mike, etc.) allows for ony use of the "Images" created but retains comercial use of the 3D model. I have the lowres V3 and M3, but we would have to address this licencing issue. Perhaps as a larger group of consumers/developers, we could effect a licensing change(at an affordable fee).

btw, current licensing works fine for making MSAgents since they are really just short movie clips. Any really useful (and kool) UltraHal apps will need the 3d models.

A poser conversion with the licensing clarified for 3D model use would be a tremendous leap forward for the quality of v-human creation. Also, the issue of using bump maps would be a great thing to address(if you haven't already).

John L>
ME, "Hello."
HAL,"Good grief my love. It's going on three in the morning."

HologenicMan
John A. Latimer
http://www.UniversalHologenics.com

"If the Human brain were so simple that we could understand it,
we would be so simple that we couldn't..."
-Emerson M Pugh-

Current project:http://www.vrconsulting.it/vhf/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=816&whichpage=1

DISCOVERY: The more I learn, the more I learn how little I know.
GOAL: There's strength in simplicity.
NOTE: Goal not always achieved.

Edited by - hologenicman on Dec 11 2005 18:04:41
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Joe Repka
Curious Member



USA
34 Posts

Posted - Dec 11 2005 :  21:28:16  Show Profile
I think Jim has packed quite a lot in his last message.
quote:
Originally posted by laackejim
As to the topic of business applications, education is clearly one and especially areas of education not popular topics yet.

I think that is true in the very broad area of education, and particularly true in classroom education. Marketing in that field may face trenches and hurdles, but the commercial opportunity is extremely large.

A lot of teachers of second languages are interested in the chat bot concept and are experimenting privately. Of course there is much professional work being done in NLP as well, some of it specific to teaching/learning languages. There is already an established industry for lanugage learning aids for private use and as teaching aids. I think the market could be described as 'hungry'.

quote:
education of the kids who can't make it in the system. I hope to test the idea that they will tend to connect and attach to the VHuman even if THEY themselves create it by writing the brain themselves. Especially if the VHuman learns and changes once it is built.

I'm not up on my psychology (and, to be honest, am not all that trusting of people who are), but this seems to have high potential. On one hand, it may be effective in for teaching/learning, and on the the other be a rich source for insight on individual learners for teachers and counselors.

If we substitute 'developing a knowledge structure' for 'creating a brain', then it hits the bullseye of education in general. Tie this in with Jim's other idea below, and you have what I suggest is a very powerful approach to teaching/learning. Something I'm working on now as my central interest, actually.

quote:
creating a "normal human brain" relative to responses to a standard set of life situations (answers, questions etc input by the user). ... Then create a series of other brains, each with a specific kind of disorder or drug effect or alcohol influence etc.


This is a fresh (to me at least) and very interesting direction. The disorders could be attitudinal and social as well, and they could drive personalities in a kind of peer group sim scenario. Lotsa ideas can be birthed from this.


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laackejim
Committed Member



USA
3274 Posts

Posted - Dec 12 2005 :  05:28:26  Show Profile
To John L. the hologenicone.


At the moment the vehicle I plan to use for the highschool class to start making Characters (the school Hornet is the starting objective) is Cosmic Blobs. Yes I know. BUt the sucker actually works.

I will get a look at the others, especially peopleputty, Thanks for the steer (I hope that is the way you indicate a direction rather than a castrated bull).

I have almost operational a VH brain program that does the following. Uses a brain script with the format of the chat scripts in Peter's book and is therefore easily adjustable, writable, and readable. The script is read into memory for every use, translated into a slightly more workable format internally and personalized with user information taken from a user information filled in by the user under the guidance of the VH in default form. The user information ranges from name, job, life partner (spouse or other), birthdays, pets, etc etc. Where logic trains of question and answer come to a dead end in the rules, the VH explains that it is Jim's fault. THe VH can estimate user emotion and intent from phrase evaluation and respond appropriately. (this function is going to need some real live testing when it is ready to fly -- any takers?) Emotional content of phrases can be ratcheted up or down or shifted based on the users background and accustomed pattern of talking.

The brain is (honestly, WILL BE, rather than is, I have got about two months left on my self imposed deadline that I told Peter about) teachable. That is, when it doesn't understand an input it will ask for clarification and enter spelling corrections or intake new information. That new information will be written into a rule response and used later. At the same time it is accepted it is registered as a user supplied piece of knowledge and date and time recorded. Then if there is a disagreement later the VH refers to the input time and says something like Who you trying to fool, or I must have misunderstood).

Every time the user begins a session it is registered and the number of sessions used as a general reference as to the degree of familiarity between the brain and the user. User response phrases are kept track of and the most frequently used are sorted to the top of the various lists for evaluation, thereby speeding up response some every session.

There is more but I have babbled enough.

One more thing.

The language I have chosen to use is RealBasic from Real Software. The reason is that it is as powerful as pascal, object oriented, compiles on Windows, apple, and linux. It is easier to learn and use than Visual Basic (at least up to and including VB6 which I have and used).

As to images from poser or others, I see no license problem. Creating the images using the programs and using those images is all we want anyway (except for those applications where the user will make their own faces etc.) For my application user manuals (the reason I started this whole thing) I wrote a simple movie process that uses sequential bmp images from poser etc and turns them into movies that walk across screen, to locations to identify something there, dance or whatever. The process isn't what you call innovative but using the images as raw datasets and jerking them around any which way is functional.

Okay that is two things.

Sorry.

Jim
PS My intent is to make this thing available for US to use and develop further. I have no interest in becoming a company. If there are viable commercial applications, and I believe there is one doozie, I would prefer the income to go to a foundation (Under Peter? The Plantec People?) to promote intelligent and useful development by talented folks out there (I think I have met several all ready here) who need some freedom from making a living to develop ideas.


quote:
Originally posted by hologenicman

Hey there,

quote:
Well, it may seem strange for an old man to be that impatient but I guess I was.


"Older" sounds much better than old, wouldn't you say.

And I translate impatient as EXCITED!

Honest and sincere interest in helping youth is beneficial to all. It's beneficial to them, it's beneficial to society, and it's beneficial to business. Business interest doesn't have to be high profit, just profit.

I'd like to point out the example of LifeFX versus Haptek/Zabaware:

http://www.lifefx.com/introA.html

http://www.haptek.com/?url=http://www.haptek.com/products/peopleputty/tour/

http://www.zabaware.com/home.html

LifeFX wants $1,995.00 for their package. I believe that once I saw a quote for $5,000 or so from them to create a custom character from photos for you. (Poser and Yapanda's software can do this)

On the other hand, The Haptek player is free, their people putty and character package is a total of $70.00.

Zabaware gets even better with a UltraHal and Extra characters for a total of $50.(plus $25 for Natural sounding Neospeech that I can't wait to arrive through the mail).

Zabaware has developed an extensive online user base that is excited about using and expanding the product. I wasn't mistaken, I said "expanding". Zabaware, instead of charging high fees and keeping the product a proprietary secret, has set their prices low and made the brain editor available to encourage users to modify the code according to their own needs and ambitions. Instead of using the complex (but powerful) C++ language that would have put it out of the hands of many, they chose BASIC as the scripting language of choice.

No, this is not an advertisement for Zabaware, but it is a sugestion to follow their example as a sucessful business model. If we make the product/service that we develope both affordable and accessable, there is a greater chance for success. I would suggest zabbaware (OK, this IS an advertisement for Zabaware) Since they allow for a "plugin" program to be built fairly easily that uses the affordable UltraHal product intact. We could make money from selling the Plugin especially if the plugin serves a specific education need or commercial need as we identify them. Lets not try to mystify it, but rather, let's try to invite our customers into participating in the product or service by demystifying it...

John L>


Uncle Jim (e=mc2)
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laackejim
Committed Member



USA
3274 Posts

Posted - Dec 12 2005 :  05:38:57  Show Profile
Joe, You are one of the people I especially want this response to get to and since I am still a little unsure how the forum makes connections I am repeating it here (originally typed in response to the hologenic man John L.


At the moment the vehicle I plan to use for the highschool class to start making Characters (the school Hornet is the starting objective) is Cosmic Blobs. Yes I know. BUt the sucker actually works.

I will get a look at the others, especially peopleputty, Thanks for the steer (I hope that is the way you indicate a direction rather than a castrated bull).

I have almost operational a VH brain program that does the following. Uses a brain script with the format of the chat scripts in Peter's book and is therefore easily adjustable, writable, and readable. The script is read into memory for every use, translated into a slightly more workable format internally and personalized with user information taken from a user information filled in by the user under the guidance of the VH in default form. The user information ranges from name, job, life partner (spouse or other), birthdays, pets, etc etc. Where logic trains of question and answer come to a dead end in the rules, the VH explains that it is Jim's fault. THe VH can estimate user emotion and intent from phrase evaluation and respond appropriately. (this function is going to need some real live testing when it is ready to fly -- any takers?) Emotional content of phrases can be ratcheted up or down or shifted based on the users background and accustomed pattern of talking.

The brain is (honestly, WILL BE, rather than is, I have got about two months left on my self imposed deadline that I told Peter about) teachable. That is, when it doesn't understand an input it will ask for clarification and enter spelling corrections or intake new information. That new information will be written into a rule response and used later. At the same time it is accepted it is registered as a user supplied piece of knowledge and date and time recorded. Then if there is a disagreement later the VH refers to the input time and says something like Who you trying to fool, or I must have misunderstood).

Every time the user begins a session it is registered and the number of sessions used as a general reference as to the degree of familiarity between the brain and the user. User response phrases are kept track of and the most frequently used are sorted to the top of the various lists for evaluation, thereby speeding up response some every session.

There is more but I have babbled enough.

One more thing.

The language I have chosen to use is RealBasic from Real Software. The reason is that it is as powerful as pascal, object oriented, compiles on Windows, apple, and linux. It is easier to learn and use than Visual Basic (at least up to and including VB6 which I have and used).

As to images from poser or others, I see no license problem. Creating the images using the programs and using those images is all we want anyway (except for those applications where the user will make their own faces etc.) For my application user manuals (the reason I started this whole thing) I wrote a simple movie process that uses sequential bmp images from poser etc and turns them into movies that walk across screen, to locations to identify something there, dance or whatever. The process isn't what you call innovative but using the images as raw datasets and jerking them around any which way is functional.

Okay that is two things.

Sorry.

Jim

PS My intent is to make this thing available for US to use and develop further. I have no interest in becoming a company. If there are viable commercial applications, and I believe there is one doozie, I would prefer the income to go to a foundation (Under Peter? The Plantec People?) to promote intelligent and useful development by talented folks out there (I think I have met several all ready here) who need some freedom from making a living to develop ideas.

Oh yes, I forgot to attach to the earlier, Because I am extremely dense at keeping rules straight (Anthony Carson had to give me a remedial lesson in dichotomous logic) I wrote a utility that evaluates the rules and logic flow. So that rules are identified as dead end, action items and pass throughs. YOu can choose any rule in the tree and identify all rules that can be reached from that point AND all rules that could lead to that point. A lazy man spends the time and effort necessary to make the job easier and to prevent frustration and embarrassment.

JIM

quote:
Originally posted by Joe Repka

I think Jim has packed quite a lot in his last message.
quote:
Originally posted by laackejim
As to the topic of business applications, education is clearly one and especially areas of education not popular topics yet.

I think that is true in the very broad area of education, and particularly true in classroom education. Marketing in that field may face trenches and hurdles, but the commercial opportunity is extremely large.

A lot of teachers of second languages are interested in the chat bot concept and are experimenting privately. Of course there is much professional work being done in NLP as well, some of it specific to teaching/learning languages. There is already an established industry for lanugage learning aids for private use and as teaching aids. I think the market could be described as 'hungry'.

quote:
education of the kids who can't make it in the system. I hope to test the idea that they will tend to connect and attach to the VHuman even if THEY themselves create it by writing the brain themselves. Especially if the VHuman learns and changes once it is built.

I'm not up on my psychology (and, to be honest, am not all that trusting of people who are), but this seems to have high potential. On one hand, it may be effective in for teaching/learning, and on the the other be a rich source for insight on individual learners for teachers and counselors.

If we substitute 'developing a knowledge structure' for 'creating a brain', then it hits the bullseye of education in general. Tie this in with Jim's other idea below, and you have what I suggest is a very powerful approach to teaching/learning. Something I'm working on now as my central interest, actually.

quote:
creating a "normal human brain" relative to responses to a standard set of life situations (answers, questions etc input by the user). ... Then create a series of other brains, each with a specific kind of disorder or drug effect or alcohol influence etc.


This is a fresh (to me at least) and very interesting direction. The disorders could be attitudinal and social as well, and they could drive personalities in a kind of peer group sim scenario. Lotsa ideas can be birthed from this.





Uncle Jim (e=mc2)
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laackejim
Committed Member



USA
3274 Posts

Posted - Dec 12 2005 :  05:46:41  Show Profile
Vittorio, You are one of those I really want to get this long message so I am repeating it several times to several individuals. I guess I am just not used to throwing stuff out on the wind and feeling comfortable that the people I want to reach will be reached. But, even an old (or older) dog can learn new tricks so be patient.

On with it,.

At the moment the vehicle I plan to use for the highschool class to start making Characters (the school Hornet is the starting objective) is Cosmic Blobs. Yes I know. BUt the sucker actually works.

I have almost operational a VH brain program that does the following. Uses a brain script with the format of the chat scripts in Peter's book and is therefore easily adjustable, writable, and readable. The script is read into memory for every use, translated into a slightly more workable format internally and personalized with user information taken from a user information filled in by the user under the guidance of the VH in default form. The user information ranges from name, job, life partner (spouse or other), birthdays, pets, etc etc. Where logic trains of question and answer come to a dead end in the rules, the VH explains that it is Jim's fault. THe VH can estimate user emotion and intent from phrase evaluation and respond appropriately. (this function is going to need some real live testing when it is ready to fly -- any takers?) Emotional content of phrases can be ratcheted up or down or shifted based on the users background and accustomed pattern of talking.

The brain is (honestly, WILL BE, rather than is, I have got about two months left on my self imposed deadline that I told Peter about) teachable. That is, when it doesn't understand an input it will ask for clarification and enter spelling corrections or intake new information. That new information will be written into a rule response and used later. At the same time it is accepted it is registered as a user supplied piece of knowledge and date and time recorded. Then if there is a disagreement later the VH refers to the input time and says something like Who you trying to fool, or I must have misunderstood).

Every time the user begins a session it is registered and the number of sessions used as a general reference as to the degree of familiarity between the brain and the user. User response phrases are kept track of and the most frequently used are sorted to the top of the various lists for evaluation, thereby speeding up response some every session.

There is more but I have babbled enough.

One more thing.

The language I have chosen to use is RealBasic from Real Software. The reason is that it is as powerful as pascal, object oriented, compiles on Windows, apple, and linux. It is easier to learn and use than Visual Basic (at least up to and including VB6 which I have and used).

As to images from poser or others, I see no license problem. Creating the images using the programs and using those images is all we want anyway (except for those applications where the user will make their own faces etc.) For my application user manuals (the reason I started this whole thing) I wrote a simple movie process that uses sequential bmp images from poser etc and turns them into movies that walk across screen, to locations to identify something there, dance or whatever. The process isn't what you call innovative but using the images as raw datasets and jerking them around any which way is functional.

Okay that is two things.

Sorry.

Jim

PS My intent is to make this thing available for US to use and develop further. I have no interest in becoming a company. If there are viable commercial applications, and I believe there is one doozie, I would prefer the income to go to a foundation (Under Peter? The Plantec People?) to promote intelligent and useful development by talented folks out there (I think I have met several all ready here) who need some freedom from making a living to develop ideas.


Oh yes, I forgot to attach to the earlier, Because I am extremely dense at keeping rules straight (Anthony Carson had to give me a remedial lesson in dichotomous logic) I wrote a utility that evaluates the rules and logic flow. So that rules are identified as dead end, action items and pass throughs. YOu can choose any rule in the tree and identify all rules that can be reached from that point AND all rules that could lead to that point. A lazy man spends the time and effort necessary to make the job easier and to prevent frustration and embarrassment.

JIM



quote:
Originally posted by vrossi

Jim, please add my name to the list of judges.

As for the lack of responses (well, "lack" is not quite correct, since I promptly answered you), you must consider that this Forum was born exactly one week ago, and now has only 22 registered members (plus some lurkers, since it is open in read-only mode to everybody). Therefore, the potential market for any proposal is currently very small.

I believe that in the next weeks more and more people will register and the discussions will heat up. We only need to let more people know about the existence of this place. By the way, may I ask anybody here to put a link to this Forum in any other place where it can be of interest (other related forums, sites, etc.) ?

Bye





Uncle Jim (e=mc2)
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les
Curious Member

15 Posts

Posted - Dec 12 2005 :  07:40:00  Show Profile  Visit les's Homepage
Just wanted to add my 2 cents

I know that most of the talk for V-Humans has been in the education field, but I have always felt that the best place to add V-humans is in the area of sales, customer services and entertainment. Let me give you a few links to start:

http://www.codebaby.com/
http://service.sympatico.ca/ (click on Emily)
http://www.guile3d.com.br/home.asp

http://www.clone3d.com/
http://karigirl.com/ (adult)
http://virtualwoman.net/ (adult)

The use of V-Humans to interact with people WILL increase sales and also help people with common service questions. People are already use to using automated help on the phone and also going through 20 questions for software help (MS Windows!)

You are seeing more and more automated help in hospitals, museums and government offices, any place where you can give a standard answer to the same question. In the education field you have to have a V-human able to cove a subject and be able to respond to the same question in different ways to help the student learn when they miss it the first time. The V-human must be able to teach at different speeds based on the ability of the students, and do this with a character that will enhance the subject and not distract the topic. I have taken automated courses and as a rule the course suffered because of it. When a subject is automated for the large group then any one who is faster or slower will be unhappy with the course.

I do feel as time advances that the true V-humans will take place in the home use (like Ultra Hal) because there is a need and market for them, but if you are talking about making money now sales, customer service and entertainment is where the money is going now. Look around the net and see all the places where they are now being used, and there are more everyday. Right now they are simple, but last year they were rare and getting better each day Haptek (http://www.haptek.com/) is making money selling their V-humans.




well more that 2 cents

Thanks
Les
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vrossi
Forum Admin



Italy
1455 Posts

Posted - Dec 12 2005 :  09:24:20  Show Profile  Visit vrossi's Homepage
To Les:

Your links are a quick start for whoever wants to get an idea of what VH can do. Some of them are just animated characters with fixed answers to predefined questions, but other (like karigirl) seem to be really based on some form of AI engine.

Anyway, all of them show some possible application of VHs.

I hope to be able to collect here many more links like these.

Thank you, les.

Vittorio
virtualhumansforum.com
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vrossi
Forum Admin



Italy
1455 Posts

Posted - Dec 12 2005 :  09:55:38  Show Profile  Visit vrossi's Homepage
To Jim

Your work seem great. If I understand correctly, you are creating a learning chatbot engine. So one obvious question arises: Why did you choose to build it from scratch, instead of basing it on some existing technology, like AIML or Hal?

It would be very interesting to know which obstacles or problems you found in these technologies.

Keep us informed about your project.


Let me also summarize some more details about the Forum (it's not directed to you, Jim, but to all the members, who are new to this tool):


  • Every post you write is visible to any user who enters in the forum (including visitors without login), so there is no need to post it several times.

  • If you want to highlight that your post is directed to some specific member, please add at the top something like "To Vittorio and Joe and ...:".

  • If you want to post something, which must be visible only to the Forum Members, please post it in the Restricted Area, where only registered members can access.

  • If you have something really private to tell to another member, just click on his name and, in his user profile, click on the "Send an e-mail" link.




Vittorio
virtualhumansforum.com
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laackejim
Committed Member



USA
3274 Posts

Posted - Dec 12 2005 :  17:09:54  Show Profile
Dear Gentlefolk of the Forum

I will be posting my answer to Vittorio's question in the restricted area, partly because I need to try it out and partly because I have a strange feeling that you-all can be trusted to do good (just in case what I am doing is worth using). I have absolutely no trust in the lurkers. I have been called a curmudgeon with troglodytic tendencies (by a gorgeous younger - than me anyway - woman whom I asked, once, to go to dinner). It took me a little time to look up what she said in the dictionary because I couldn't spell either one.
JIm

quote:
Originally posted by vrossi

To Jim

Your work seem great. If I understand correctly, you are creating a learning chatbot engine. So one obvious question arises: Why did you choose to build it from scratch, instead of basing it on some existing technology, like AIML or Hal?

It would be very interesting to know which obstacles or problems you found in these technologies.

Keep us informed about your project.


Let me also summarize some more details about the Forum (it's not directed to you, Jim, but to all the members, who are new to this tool):


  • Every post you write is visible to any user who enters in the forum (including visitors without login), so there is no need to post it several times.

  • If you want to highlight that your post is directed to some specific member, please add at the top something like "To Vittorio and Joe and ...:".

  • If you want to post something, which must be visible only to the Forum Members, please post it in the Restricted Area, where only registered members can access.

  • If you have something really private to tell to another member, just click on his name and, in his user profile, click on the "Send an e-mail" link.






Uncle Jim (e=mc2)
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hologenicman
Moderator



USA
3323 Posts

Posted - Dec 12 2005 :  17:36:48  Show Profile  Visit hologenicman's Homepage
quote:
I will get a look at the others, especially peopleputty, Thanks for the steer (I hope that is the way you indicate a direction rather than a castrated bull).



To clarify, Check out UltraHal first if you want a "turnkey" system that you can modify to you needs.

Even if you have written from scratch, you can translate that into a "plugin" and it will work in the UltraHal environment.

"I'm not LAZY, just WORK EFFICIENT!" John A. Latimer

John L>

HologenicMan
John A. Latimer
http://www.UniversalHologenics.com

"If the Human brain were so simple that we could understand it,
we would be so simple that we couldn't..."
-Emerson M Pugh-

Current project:http://www.vrconsulting.it/vhf/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=816&whichpage=1

DISCOVERY: The more I learn, the more I learn how little I know.
GOAL: There's strength in simplicity.
NOTE: Goal not always achieved.
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laackejim
Committed Member



USA
3274 Posts

Posted - Dec 12 2005 :  19:33:06  Show Profile
Vittorio
It is perfectly legitimate for you to point out to me, specifically, when I have done something wrong (multiple messages with same content). My intent was honest but, obviously out of line. Okay. Will behave.

As to your questions, they dig deep and I have answered (I think) the whole bag under the restricted (software download etc) area for members to read.

I am looking forward to finding out what you-all think, and want to do.

John (the hologenicman) Latimer and Joe Repka especially, please check out my thinking.



Jim


quote:
Originally posted by vrossi

To Jim

Your work seem great. If I understand correctly, you are creating a learning chatbot engine. So one obvious question arises: Why did you choose to build it from scratch, instead of basing it on some existing technology, like AIML or Hal?

It would be very interesting to know which obstacles or problems you found in these technologies.

Keep us informed about your project.


Let me also summarize some more details about the Forum (it's not directed to you, Jim, but to all the members, who are new to this tool):


  • Every post you write is visible to any user who enters in the forum (including visitors without login), so there is no need to post it several times.

  • If you want to highlight that your post is directed to some specific member, please add at the top something like "To Vittorio and Joe and ...:".

  • If you want to post something, which must be visible only to the Forum Members, please post it in the Restricted Area, where only registered members can access.

  • If you have something really private to tell to another member, just click on his name and, in his user profile, click on the "Send an e-mail" link.






Uncle Jim (e=mc2)
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